In fact, AXA, the giant French insurer, is talking with Deutsche Bank about a possible alliance.

For one thing, a conflict of interest - or at least the suggestion of it - would arise from a giant insurer's owning a big brokerage firm.

Investigators' focus on Mr. Greenberg, the former chairman of the American International Group, the giant insurer, is intensifying.

But he remains loyal to Aetna's heritage as a giant insurer with myriad property, life and health insurance offerings for individuals and businesses.

Empire still faces the fundamental task of selling its managed-care programs to large corporate and union customers at a troubled time for the giant insurer.

The executives who run these giant mutual insurers see conversion to stock ownership as crucial for their continued survival.

Now ArcaEx, an electronic-exchange upstart, has gained a dual listing from American International Group, the giant insurer.

The American International Group, a giant insurer, reported yesterday that third-quarter net income fell 8.6 percent because of losses from three major storms.

If so, policy makers must be aware that the giant insurers are likely to become the cooperatives' administrators.

Among them is 445 Hamilton Avenue in White Plains, a 320,000-square-foot building owned and partially occupied by MetLife, the giant insurer.